How Old?

When people, whether atheist or “Christian”, propose an old earth they are contending against the truth of the Scripture that God created the heavens and the earth in six literal days and generations later sent a worldwide deluge to destroy all life on the earth.  Since the creation is a supernatural event, not a natural one, just as Adam and Eve were created mature and able to reproduce, so too the world was created mature and able to support life created by God.  The universe was fully functioning indicating an age even though just created.  The geographical features were intact at that point indicating an age to the earth, just as Adam, Eve and all the creatures were created mature and fully able to produce.  Creation is a supernatural event not a natural event so time is not necessary to explain the topographical features of the planet.

31 Then God saw everything that He had made, and indeed it was very good.  So the evening and the morning were the sixth day.  Genesis 1:31

3 For the Lord is the great God, And the great King above all gods.  4 In is hand are the deep places of the earth; The heights of the hills are His also.  5 The sea is His, for He made it; And His hands formed the dry land.  Psalm 95:3-5

24 O Lord, how manifold are Your works!  In wisdom You have made them all.  The earth is full of Your possessions—25 This great and wide sea, In which are innumerable teeming things, Living things both small and great.  26 There the ships sail about; There is that Leviathan Which You have made to play there.  27 These all wait for You, That You may give them their food in due season.  28 What You give them they gather in; You open Your hand, they are filled with good.  29 You hide Your face they are troubled; You take away their breath, they die and return to their dust.  30 You send forth Your Spirit, they are created; And you renew the face of the earth.  Psalm 104:24-30

12 Who has measured the waters in the hollow of His hand, Measured heaven with a span And calculated the dust of the earth in a measure?  Weighed the mountains in scales And the hills in a balance?  Isaiah 40:12

5 Thus says God the Lord, Who created the heavens and stretched them out, Who spread forth the earth and that which comes from it, Who gives breath to the people on it, and spirit to those who walk on it:  Isaiah 42:5

12 I have made the earth, And created man on it.  I—My hands—stretched out the heavens, And all their host I commanded.  Isaiah 45:12

18 For thus says the Lord, Who created the heavens, Who is God, Who formed the earth and made it, Who has established it, Who did not create it in vain, Who formed it to be inhabited:  “I am the Lord, and there is no other.”  Isaiah 45:18

6 “But from the beginning of the creation, God ‘made them male and female.’  7 For this reason a man shall leave his father and mother and be joined to his wife, 8 and the two shall become one flesh’, so then they are no longer two, but one flesh.”  Mark 10:6-8

1 In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God, and the Word was God.  2 He was in the beginning with God.  3 All things were made through Him, and without Him nothing was made that was made.  John 1:1-3

20 For since the creation of the world His invisible attributes are clearly seen being understood by the things that are made, even His eternal power and Godhead, so that they are without excuse,.. Romans 1:20

3 By faith we understand that the worlds were framed by the word of God, so that the things which are seen were not made of things which are visible.  Hebrews 11:3

11”You are worthy, O Lord, To receive glory and honor and power; For You created all things, And by Your will they exist and were created.”  Revelation 4:11

God created the earth to be populated so it had to have features that would support life at the moment of creation.  There were mountains, hills, rivers, oceans, lakes, forests, plateaus, savannas, valleys, etc. all able to support and sustain life.  The planet which God made to be inhabited became the home of violent sinners whose only imagination was wickedness always.  He brought judgment upon humanity through the worldwide flood.  It is this flood that accounts for the fossil record and stratification of the sediment upon the earth.  Although topographical change can be slow and minute, it took a major catastrophe to explain the dramatic story preserved for us in the geological record.  Those who propose an old earth do so because they disregard the testimony of God given to us in His Scripture, the Bible, and they twist the evidence to support their preconceived notions which do not include the knowledge of God.

10 And it came to pass after seven days that the waters of the flood were on the earth.  11 In the six hundredth year of Noah’s life, in the second month, the seventeenth day of the month, on that day all the fountains of the great deep were broken up, and the windows of heaven were opened.  12 And the rain was on the earth forty days and forty nights…18 The waters prevailed and greatly increased on the earth, and the ark moved about on the surface of the waters.  19 And the waters prevailed exceedingly on the earth, and all the high hills under the whole heaven were covered.  20 The waters prevailed fifteen cubits upward, and the mountains were covered.  21 And all flesh died that moved on the earth:  birds and cattle and beasts and every creeping thing that creeps on the earth, and every man.  22 All in whose nostrils was the breath of the spirit of life, all that was on the dry land died.  Genesis 7:10-12, 18-21 

“For as in the days before the flood, they were eating and drinking, marrying and giving in marriage, until the day that Noah entered the ark, 39 and did not know until the flood came and took them all away, so also will the coming of the Son of Man be.  Matthew 24:38-39

5 and did not spare the ancient world, but saved Noah, one of eight people, a preacher of righteousness, bringing in the flood on the world of the ungodly;.. 2 Peter 2:5

5 For this they willfully forget:  that by the word of God the heavens were of old, and the earth standing out of water and in the water, 6 by which the world that then existed perished, being flooded with water.  2 Peter 3:5-6

Just as a volcano, meteor strike, hurricane, slide or a flood has the ability to dramatically alter the topography of an area, the geology of the world was dramatically altered by God’s judgment upon mankind through the worldwide flood.  There are many evidences that support what God has said in His Word about the worldwide flood.  Here are a few for us to consider.

Fossilization must be a rapid event in order to avoid complete decomposition of the organisms.  There are fossils of leaves with incredible detail preserved in the rock imprint, a seven foot long ichthyosaur was fossilized while giving birth, and there of fossils of fish swallowing other fish.1  Add to this the growing number of fossils where biomaterial is still present i.e., a mummified ancient camel with areas of collagen still intact, an ape fossil with intact skin, ink was reconstituted from the fossil remains of a squid with an intact ink sac, a marine reptile fossil with eye pigmentation, dried blood residue, and intact skin throughout the body, and chitin discovered in a scorpion and cuttlefish fossils.2  This could not occur over vast amounts, millions of years, of time.  Fossilization must be rapid in order to preserve the fine detail of fragile leaves, and capture birth and predation.  Biomaterial must be fossilized quickly in order for it to be preserved.  These examples testify to a quick inundation and sedimentation for rapid fossilization.

The flood actually explains the world wide fossil record found on all seven continents.  It is also where these fossils have been found that agrees with what God’s Word has made known to us.  Marine crustaceans have been discovered on 12,000 foot mountaintops, pillow lava which only forms under water has been found as high as 15,000 feet on Mount Ararart, Norfolk forest beds in England have the fossils of northern cold-climate animals, tropical warm climate animals, and temperate zone plants all mixed together, and a whale’s skeleton was found on top of the 3000 foot high Sanhorn Mountain on the Arctic Coast.3  To find pillow lava at such a high altitude bespeaks the reality of the global flood.  A major flood in which animal carcasses were transported out of their normal range and then also preserved with animals and plants from other habitats explains these phenomena.

Texas A&M microbiologist Dr. Bert Thompson described the impact of the flood accordingly:

Vast animal graveyards and fossiliferous rubble shifts have been found worldwide.  Evidence of a great, sudden, and recent water cataclysm, followed by a deep freeze, across the entire great north, accompanied by titanic hydraulic forces and crustal upheavals, burying a host of mammoths, mastodons, elephants and other great beasts in a regions which is now almost totally devoid of vegetation has been documented.

Vast numbers of fossil trees and plants, standing erect, oblique and even inverted while piercing through successive beds of water-laid stone have been discovered.  There is abundant evidence of profuse vegetation and a temperate, even subtropical climate prevailing in Antarctica and the north polarregions at some time in the past.

Worldwide fossilization has occurred in vast quantities, including fossils in sedimentary strata, often at great depths and under great pressure.  Vast and numerous rifts, fissures, and lava beds have been discovered, scarring the world ocean floor, all clearly recent and speak of some gigantic submarine upheaval of the earth’s crust (as in breaking up of the fountains of the deep”).  Marine fossils have been found buried and exposed at almost every altitude.  And on and on and on such evidences could be listed.4

Testimony to the worldwide flood sent and orchestrated by God isn’t found only in the Scriptures, it is found in many other histories and traditions throughout the world.  The Canadian geologist J. William Dawon, wrote the following:

Further, we know that the deluge of Noah is not mere myth or fancy of primitive man or solely a doctrine of the Hebrew Scriptures.  The record of the catastrophe is preserved in some of the oldest historical documents of several distinct races of men, and is indirectly corroborated by the whole tenor of the early history of most of the civilized races.5

Dr. Bert Thompson also documented historical records of the flood:

The account of the Genesis flood hardly stands alone.  Researchers have described over 100 flood traditions from Europe, Asia, Australia, the East Indies, the Americas, East Africa, and many other places.  Almost all accounts agree on these points:

universal, worldwide flood

all mankind perished

an ark

a seed of mankind survived to perpetuate the human race.6

God’s Word is true, of that we can be sure, and the evidence supports the veracity of the Scriptures.  Most Bible believers are not dogmatic about the thousands of years the earth has existed, but they are sure that the earth is not millions of years old nor does it need to be to explain what we see around us.  The Holy Word of God explains it all very nicely for us.  We just need to decide who we are going to believe.  The wise choice is to believe God and what He has said in His Word.  God bless us.

4 Certainly not!  Indeed, let God be true but every man a liar.  As it is written:  “That You may be justified in Your words, And may overcome when You are judged.”  Romans 3:4

  1. Dr. Joe White and Dr. Nicholas Comninellis, Darwin’s Demise (Master Books: Green Forest, AR, 2001)
  2. 57
  3. Friday Church News Notes, May 17, 2013, http://www.wayoflife.org,
  4. Dr. Joe White and Dr. Nicholas Comninellis, Darwin’s Demise
  5. Ibid
  6. Ibid

 

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100 Responses to How Old?

  1. Arkenaten says:

    So every Christian who is not a Young Earth Creationist is going to hell because they do not believe God’s word, right?

    Like

    • Eliza says:

      Whether born again through faith in Jesus Christ, or an unbeliever they both need to repent of letting man’s doctrine supersede God’s sure word.
      If there isn’t any repentance then it is questionable whether or not one is a genuine believer, because accepting the testimony of the Bible is a work of the Holy Spirit in the life of His children, and though we can be deceived for a time, He will ultimately bring us to reject the lie and hold fast the truth. Those who reject the Scripture give evidence they have never had that supernatural encounter with Christ where He transforms them from objects of wrath bound for destruction in hell, to beloved children destined to spend eternity in heaven with God their Father and Jesus Christ their Lord and Savior.

      Liked by 4 people

      • Arkenaten says:

        Yes, this is all about acknowledging Jesus being god and being prepared to repent. I know this.
        What I am asking is whether you or your doctrine believes that those Christians who hold to an Old Earth and also those Christians who accept evolution are simply in error but will still be with Christ after the die because of their faith or are they willfully in error and will be banished to Hell?

        Which one do consider the truth?

        Like

    • archaeopteryx1 says:

      I just can’t do it, Ark – I thought I’d give it a try, but I could spend hours, days even, trying to rebutt this idiocy, and still wind up banging my head on the computer screen. There is no cure for stupid, and life’s too short to even try. Sorry Pal, you’re on your own – beauty may be only skin deep, but stupid goes all the way to the bone.

      Liked by 2 people

      • archaeopteryx1 says:

        Here – you may need this —

        Like

      • Eliza says:

        You make me laugh! Funny humor, too bad you mean it though. It is just so sad that this is the best that you can do when confronted with the truth. I am always hoping for your repentance and faith in Jesus Christ. You know, He came into the world to save sinners, even someone like you.
        This is slightly humorous to me, because I was treated with such kindness and love by believers when I assailed them as a willful rebellious atheistic sinner. They were so meek and mild and prayed for me. Well, God answered their prayers, praise His name. I now belong to Him because of His great goodness. I pray God will have mercy on you Ark and bring you into the fold. If He can save such a wicked one as myself, then He can save you too. Dear Jesus Christ please bless this man with your salvation!

        Liked by 1 person

  2. Wally Fry says:

    Lots of good information Eliza thanks and many blessings

    Liked by 2 people

  3. Wally Fry says:

    Ark. You are a liar. In case you were not clear as to what I said let me rephrase. You tell lies. I have never said what you assign to me nor do I believe that
    I write clearly about the lost condition of man and what it takes to escape condemnation.
    You sir tell lies and intentionally twist the words of others to fit you own agenda. Of course that agenda is to make God and his followers bad enough to justify your rejection.

    To be clear belief in an old earth does not condemn one to Hell.

    Eliza I hope you don’t find my calling a visitor on your blog a liar offensive. If you do I apologize to you

    Liked by 2 people

    • Arkenaten says:

      So what exactly is Eliza saying then?
      Please explain.

      Like

    • Arkenaten says:

      And just why am I lying? I am asking a question.

      Like

      • Wally Fry says:

        You attributed words to me I never said. You asked me that question in such a way as to create the appearance that I believed what you were asking. That makes you a liar and manipulator

        Liked by 2 people

        • Arkenaten says:

          What words did I attribute to you? Are you going frakking nuts? I simply asked if you concurred with Eliza. It seems she is saying if one is not a YEC and does not believe in a literal interpretation of the Bible one is not a proper Christian.
          I asked to make sure my interpretation was correct and if you agreed. And I only asked because I know you are a YEC and you commented on the post.
          I wouldn’t have bothered otherwise.
          I think you are going round the damn bend!
          So if Old Earth Creationists are not Hell Bound just what the heck is Eliza saying? She deleted the last comment I asked for clarification.
          You tell me what she is saying?

          Like

    • Arkenaten says:

      Still waiting for your reply Wally. Don’t run and hide now.

      Like

  4. someone can be wrong and hold to incorrect beliefs about Evilution and an old earth. Your belief in that does not mean you are not saved.
    However, it’s one of those “fruits of salvation” things that we look for, to see if you believe the bible literally. If you don’t believe the Bible literally, you’re in the “you’re starting to scare me” territory.
    As Wally and Eliza pointed out it is – have you recognized you are a sinner? Do you acknowledge you cannot save yourself? Do you acknowledge Jesus Christ is who He says He is, God in human flesh? Do you acknowledge you cannot save yourself and ask Jesus Christ to save you?
    If you did, you’re saved. But here’s the kicker – there’ll be evidence that you’re saved. And it’s amazing how many people who believed in Evilution one hour before suddenly don’t believe in it an hour after they turn to Christ.
    I get a little worried when people don’t believe that. Because when you look into that deeper, you start seeing other areas in that person’s beliefs that make you worry more, and more, and more…
    That’s what Eliza is explaining. If you don’t believe the Bible, then how can you say you believe the parts about salvation, and Jesus is who He says He is?
    So, why is your screen name/blog name the name of a pagan culture’s Pharaoh? That tends to add to the worry about your beliefs. Christians tend to pick names like holdingtohisword, truthsword, biblebeliever,warrior4christ, etc.
    I’m just asking.

    Liked by 2 people

    • Eliza says:

      That is my testimony. Once Christ met me the lie of evolution no longer had any relevance in my life. I knew the One Who is the truth and I believed what He said in the Bible. This is the work of the Holy Spirit which He performs in the lives of His children. He bears witness with our spirit that we are the children of God. Therefore we humbly submit before Him and believe what the Bible says without equivocation and obey by the power of the Holy Spirit. Unbelief and disobedience gives the appearance of an unregenerate heart and unless there’s repentance we must not associate with that one and exhort him to repent believe and obey.

      Liked by 2 people

    • Arkenaten says:

      However, it’s one of those “fruits of salvation” things that we look for, to see if you believe the bible literally. If you don’t believe the Bible literally, you’re in the “you’re starting to scare me” territory.

      This is one of those slightly ambiguous turns of phrase that suggests you are hedging your bets?
      Are Old Earth Creationists not regarded as proper Christians because their view is held in error?
      If so, and this is willful, do you as a YEC consider they are doomed and bound for Hell?
      Yes or No?
      Is this what Eliza is also saying?
      I would appreciate some definite clarity on this point, please.

      Like

      • Okay, I see what Wally was saying…. you’re trying to take out of context and twist what I say. My answer to you provided all the information you need. please read that again. this time, don’t skim the words.

        Liked by 2 people

        • Arkenaten says:

          Out of context? I always ask people to be straight with me, but the religious love to couch their comments in obfuscation and theologic-speak.
          It’s the same when you lot announce: “Oh, God doesn’t send you to hell. You choose to go by rejecting the choice to love Him.”
          Puerile drivel like this makes me want to hurl my guts.
          You had the opportunity to clarify your point. And you have surely read enough of my comments by now to understand perfectly what I was asking.
          If you feel you have been misrepresented there is a post on my blog right now addressing this very issue.
          I encourage you to pop over to my spot and state the case in PLAIN ENGLISH and set the record straight.

          And don’t blame me – I didn’t write your silly little book and you’ve all had upwards of 2000 years to put the record straight and all you have are 30,000 plus different sects and a global religious cock up.

          You must be so proud!

          Like

    • archaeopteryx1 says:

      Do you acknowledge Jesus Christ is who He says He is, God in human flesh?” – Phillip, would you please show me the scripture where Yeshua says that he is god in human flesh? Thanks —

      Like

      • Eliza says:

        29 “My Father, who has given them to Me, is greater than all; and no one is able to snatch them out of My Father’s hand. 30 I and My Father are one.” John 10:29-30

        51 “Most assuredly, I say to you, if anyone keeps My word he shall never see death.”…58 Jesus said to them, “Most assuredly, I say to you, before Abraham was, I AM. John 8:51 & 58

        9 Jesus said to him, “Have I been with you so long, and yet you have not known Me, Philip? He who has seen Me has seen the Father, so how can you say, ‘Show us the Father’? John 14:9

        Liked by 1 person

  5. ColorStorm says:

    Hey Eliza,
    Your last sentence is timely, I cite it often as well. ‘Let God be true and every man a liar.’

    It does not mean man cannot tell the truth about anything; it simply means what God says of man is true, His word is true, and if a man denies a Creator, then of course he is a liar, but why would an unbeliever care if God calls men liars? I’ll tell you why: ALL men know there is a God with whom they have to do, the truth is merely suppressed,and all ancillary issues are smokescreens.

    To ask for proof of a Creator is an insult to common sense, morality, humanity, and life itself. There is not one square inch that any man can claim as distinctly his own on this earth. It is all borrowed.

    Keep the faith Eliza,

    (To some the word of God is a savor of life, to others it is a savor of death) God’s word is forever settled in heaven.)

    Liked by 3 people

    • Eliza says:

      Thank you ColorStorm. Just as Wally was on vacation, I am too at this time. I didn’t bring my laptop, but I do have my phone. Typing while riding in the car is tricky. I’m still getting used to my IPHONE. I had a flip phone until recently. Thank you everyone for your kind input and sound explanations. I love you all. God bless us.

      Liked by 2 people

    • Arkenaten says:

      CS. Does this mean to your mind that anyone who adopts a non-literal understanding of the bible is not considered a genuine Christian and is doomed at the last, and does this also apply to those who regard themselves as Old Earth Creationists/Christians?

      Like

      • ColorStorm says:

        I do have an answer, but you have gone on record saying the word of God is irrelevant, unreliable, full of tales, etc, so ANY answer is moot.

        Hope this helps.

        Liked by 4 people

        • Arkenaten says:

          You have surely been following the dialogue between SOM and Eliza?
          He is adamant that Young Earth Creationism is wrong, and has said so numerous times.
          I recognise that Christians disagree among the various denominations/sets; this is to be expected, but I have never considered how you all viewed the fate of your fellow Christian should they not follow your particular doctrine.
          I am aware, of course , how Protestants feel about Catholics, but never encountered this particular view re: YEC before and am simply looking for clarification?
          Do you believe Old Earthers are not following the correct biblical interpretation and at the last will be judged and doomed to Hell? Is Eliza right on this point?

          Like

  6. Just because a true child of God does not believe in Creation…or does not believe every Word in the Bible is truth…doesn’t necessarily mean they don’t have the Holy Spirit (Christ Himself – Colossians 1:27) living with them… It takes spending time reading and digesting the Word of God to grow in spiritual wisdom… For the non-believer, who does not have the illumination of the Holy Spirit…it will be impossible to understand the truth found in the Bible, that will indeed set the sinner free…

    The message of the cross is foolishness to those that don’t believe…1 Corinthians 1:18-31…

    John 8:31-32… Then Jesus said to those Jews who believed Him, “If you abide in My word, you are My disciples indeed. 32 “And you shall know the truth, and the truth shall make you free.” (NKJV)

    For believers to grow in progressive sanctification (to become more and more like Christ – Romans 8:29-30)…they must spend time in the Word…
    http://www.gotquestions.org/progressive-sanctification.html

    Ark, God hasn’t gotten around to you yet, to allow the Holy Spirit to shed a little light in your stone cold heart… Heck, you may not be on God’s list of the Elect…those chosen before time began… Some would say this choosing by God is unfair… Some are sheep…and some are goats…

    I look at my salvation with praise and thanks to the Lord for placing me on His list of redeemed children… All of us deserve eternity in hell… God waited until I was 54 years old to reel me in as a keeper !!… Thank You Lord for Your longsuffering !! As I have said before Ark…I have placed you on my multiple times per day prayer list… It’s God’s work, and God’s perfect timing…and God uses His Word through the presentation of the Gospel of our Lord Jesus Christ to save people… As long as there is still breath in your body Ark…there is time left for your soul…

    If you get the urge, check out the presentation of the Gospel at the following link, on how God’s grace is received to become a Christian in God’s eyes; through understanding and obeying the gospel of our Lord Jesus Christ, after first being drawn in by God…John 6:44…

    Blessings in Christ, Ark !! bruce

    http://godsmanforever.wordpress.com/2013/07/11/gods-group-thoughts-for-7112013-the-truth-about-sin/

    Like

    • Eliza says:

      Salvation is the work of God in our hearts. He reveals our sin, His judgment and His salvation to us. He reveals that His Word is true and gives us a heart for His Word. Believing in Christ and belief that the Bible is the holy, preserved, infallible, inerrant, inspired Word of God and that He teaches us His truth that is knowable and has one interpretation gives evidence that He has saved us.
      21 I have not written to you because you do not know the truth, but because you know it, and that no lie is of the truth. 1 John 2:21
      The standard for for knowing and obeying the truth is so low within the visible church today that any and all lies are equated with the truth.

      Liked by 2 people

    • gracealone1 says:

      “Just because a true child of God does not believe in creation……….” Whoa, stop right there and read John 5:46&47: “For if you believed Moses, you would believe Me; for he wrote of Me. BUT IF YOU DO NOT BELIEVE HIS WRITINGS, HOW WILL YOU BELIEVE MY WORDS?” You do not have the option of believing or not believing the creation account AS WRITTEN BY MOSES. Nor do you have the option (as a “true child of God”) to claim Jesus as Savior and call Him a liar in the next breath. “For by Him all things were created……” Col. 1:16. “All things were made through Him, and without Him nothing was made that was made.” John 1:3. With your opening statement and succeeding premise being totally wrong, why should we believe the rest of your ignorant (of the Word of God) and unlearned philosophical nonsense? Today is a good day to repent and not further the impending judgments upon you for making such claims in the name of God. You speak contrary to the Word of God and therefore DO NOT SPEAK FOR HIM.

      Liked by 1 person

      • Eliza says:

        That’s what I was going to say. It’s odd the firestorm created when faith in God’s Word is held to by a scientist. Until the abomination of evolution many scientists held to what the Bible teaches about divine Creation.

        Like

      • archaeopteryx1 says:

        You do not have the option of believing or not believing the creation account AS WRITTEN BY MOSES.

        But Grace, the creation account wasn’t written by Moses, it was written by two separate groups of priests. Gen 2 was written by a group of Levite priests, writing in the Southern Kingdom of Judea about 950 BCE – this group has become known to biblical scholars as the “Yahwist Source.” A group of Aaronid priests, known to biblical scholars as the “Priestly Source,” in captivity in Babylon in the 6th century BCE, decided that one of the reasons for all of Israel’s troubles was that they hadn’t given their god the respect that he deserved, so they wrote a new creation story – Gen 1 – intended to replace the more anthropomorphic Gen 2, where their god came down to earth and walked around. But the redactor (editor) that pieced the Torah together 150 years later, wasn’t certain which story was true, so he included them both. Of course the authors of the Gospels had no way of knowing any of the Bible’s actual compilation history.

        Like

  7. colonialist says:

    The ultimate blasphemy is to have the petty, constrained, and patently invalid view of a Creator of all-that-is as contained in such infantile doctrines.

    Like

    • Eliza says:

      God has revealed Himself in Creation, His Son and the Bible. For us to know our great Creator we must believe what He has told us in His Word.

      Liked by 2 people

      • colonialist says:

        Surely that is not to say we need to switch off intellects which have advanced considerably beyond those of scriptural times, or ignore the knowledge which we have since progressed into acquiring. We need to move on towards accepting that God must be infinitely greater than the simplistic views there represented – suitable for the time, but now needing a far more enlightened approach. From Genesis onwards, the Bible is riddled with contradictions, improbabilities and impossibilities.

        Liked by 2 people

      • Reason is but an uncertain and deceitful instrument at the best, and the blinding pride of man makes matters still worse. For when one has set his heart upon an idea — which is, perhaps, nothing but the creation of his own fancy, as unsubstantial as the castle of a dream — his powers are thenceforth used for the single purpose of making the picture of his imagination stand out as vividly and as like reality as possible. Reason is fallible and often dangerous. But the power of the spirit is an instinctive and unerring perception of truth. And thus we may easily see that intellect is not merely fallible, but the most dangerous of all gifts, unless it be guided by the Spirit of God. For it can call evil good, and good evil: it can put darkness for light, and light for darkness; bitter for sweet, and sweet for bitter. The wave of its magic wand can fill not only this life, but even the region beyond the river of death, with sunny landscapes and fair scenes, to all of which it is able to give the semblance of firm reality, until the fatal moment which separates spirit and body, when in an instant the brilliant vista is blotted out for ever by the fiery darkness of the lost. And even in the case of those who have been born again, who have received power to become sons of God, the intellectual faculty is still so incompetent that, though they possess truth in the Divine revelation, they are nevertheless, as Paul tells us, only able for the present to know and understand it in part.

        Like

        • Eliza says:

          You have well said unless led of the Holy Spirit.

          21 I have not written to you because you do not know the truth, but because you know it, and that no lie is of the truth. 1 John 2:21

          27 But the anointing which you have received from His abides in you, and you do not need that anyone teach you; but as the same anointing teaches you concerning all things, and is true, and is not a lie, and just as it has taught you, you will abide in Him. 1 John 2:27

          God bless us.

          Liked by 1 person

  8. Peter says:

    Hi Eliza
    Whilst Christians see the Bible as containing truth, interpreting this truth is not always as straightforward as it may appear. Church history has been littered with well meaning Christians reaching different conclusions in regard to the interpretation of Scripture. As just one example in the 18th century John Wesley and George Whitefield who had worked together during the ‘Great Awakening’ had a falling out in regard to whether Scripture taught a Calvinist or Arminian approach to salvation. That these two great men of God could reach such different conclusions is a warning of the need for humility.
    Some Church’s have doctrinal statements dealing with issues like the Millennium (from Revelation) and the Ratpure (from Thessalonians). The Rapture is a teaching which has become mainstream but is of questionable origin, having been the subject of a prophetic utterance at the Catholic Apostolic Church of Edward Irving in the early 19th century.
    John Calvin, perhaps the greatest systematic theologian in the history of the church, in the 16th century suggested that Christians should be cautious in interpreting the early chapters of Genesis literally. He argued that they were in essence God’s ‘baby talk’ a way of expressing great truths in ways that unsophisticated people without a knowledge of science could understand.
    Perhaps the greatest thinker in Christian history is St Augustine. He found even in his time (the late 4th and early 5th century) there was a conflict between science and faith. His advice was:
    ‘Usually, even a non-Christian knows something about the earth, the heavens, and the other elements of this world, about the motion and orbit of the stars and even their size and relative positions, about the predictable eclipses of the sun and moon, the cycles of the years and the seasons, about the kinds of animals, shrubs, stones, and so forth, and this knowledge he hold to as being certain from reason and experience. Now, it is a disgraceful and dangerous thing for an infidel to hear a Christian, presumably giving the meaning of Holy Scripture, talking nonsense on these topics; and we should take all means to prevent such an embarrassing situation, in which people show up vast ignorance in a Christian and laugh it to scorn. The shame is not so much that an ignorant individual is derided, but that people outside the household of faith think our sacred writers held such opinions, and, to the great loss of those for whose salvation we toil, the writers of our Scripture are criticized and rejected as unlearned men. If they find a Christian mistaken in a field which they themselves know well and hear him maintaining his foolish opinions about our books, how are they going to believe those books in matters concerning the resurrection of the dead, the hope of eternal life, and the kingdom of heaven, when they think their pages are full of falsehoods and on facts which they themselves have learnt from experience and the light of reason? Reckless and incompetent expounders of Holy Scripture bring untold trouble and sorrow on their wiser brethren when they are caught in one of their mischievous false opinions and are taken to task by those who are not bound by the authority of our sacred books. For then, to defend their utterly foolish and obviously untrue statements, they will try to call upon Holy Scripture for proof and even recite from memory many passages which they think support their position, although they understand neither what they say nor the things about which they make assertion. [1 Timothy 1.7]’

    Liked by 2 people

    • Eliza says:

      Scientists who took Genesis literally brought forth great scientific discoveries that are driving technological advances that we enjoy today. Atheistic evolution has driven much evil in the world such as communism and degradation of the truth. Beware who you quote and who you approve. Augustine was a heretic. He is the father of the Catholic religion and he had undue influence on Calvin. You would do better to just read the Bible, KJV or NKJV. Study to show yourself approved rightly dividing the Word of truth.

      Liked by 2 people

      • Peter says:

        That is a bold statement to say Augustine was a heretic. Some of Augustine’s teaching were misunderstood and misapplied by the Church, but Augustine is not a person to be lightly dismissed. When Luther and Calvin were instrumental in the reformation it was to Augustine that they looked. Indeed if it had not been for Augustine, Martin Luther would not have persevered in his challenge to the church. It was only after he found that Augustine also taught salvation by grace alone that he had the confidence to take on the whole of the church.

        What is so special about the KJV and NKJV versions of the Bible? Did God come down at the time of King James and grant it a special seal of approval?

        Those who are expert in the field, who have studied the manuscripts of the early church and the writings of the church fathers would more likely support a translation such as the ESV as a more reliable translation.

        Liked by 2 people

        • Eliza says:

          Augustine was a bold heretic. The “reformers” clung to Augustine because they never threw off all of the error of the Catholic Church. Today we see the reality of this by many Protestant denominations returning to the Catholic Church.

          Liked by 2 people

      • Peter says:

        John Piper has a somewhat more charitable attitude to Augustine. He says:

        ‘The influence of Augustine in the Western World is simply staggering. Adolf Harnack said that he was the greatest man the church has possessed between Paul the Apostle and Luther the Reformer. Benjamin Warfield argued that through his writings Augustine “entered both the Church and the world as a revolutionary force, and not merely created an epoch in the history of the Church, but . . . determined the course of its history in the West up to the present day.” He had “a literary talent . . . second to none in the annals of the Church.” “The whole development of Western life, in all its phases, was powerfully affected by his teaching.” The publishers of Christian History magazine simply say, “After Jesus and Paul, Augustine of Hippo is the most influential figure in the history of Christianity.”‘

        John Pipers complete one and a half talk on Augustine can be found here:

        http://www.desiringgod.org/biographies/the-swan-is-not-silent

        Like

      • archaeopteryx1 says:

        What POSSIBLE relationship does evolution have with communism?

        Like

        • Eliza says:

          Communists are supported in their atheistic beliefs by evolution, Duh!

          Liked by 1 person

          • archaeopteryx1 says:

            I’m sorry, I’m just not seeing the connection. It would seem that to you, communism and evolution are both bad words, therefore there must be some sort of relationship, but communism is a social system of production distribution, whereas evolution involves a scientific relationship between interrelated species. They are as different as apples and oranges. (Was the “Duh” really necessary?)

            Liked by 2 people

    • Peter says:

      Hi Eliza

      I noted that you include a link to the MLJ Trust on your site, referring to it as sound teaching. If you listen to sermon #3346, subtitled ‘Sanctification’ dealing with Romans 13:11-14 Dr Lloyd-Jones refers to the role this text played in the conversion of St Augustine:

      “This passage is forever to be associated with the final conversion of that GREAT man St Augustine of Hippo….It was the great turning point in the life of St Augustine. That in a sense doesn’t add to the Scriptures but we are all in the flesh and these associations sometimes are of very great value to us. A passage that has been used like that in the conversion of SUCH A GIANT is obviously worthy of our unusual attention.”

      Liked by 1 person

  9. Eliza says:

    Those who believe that God created the heavens and the earth and all it contains
    bear witness to what God has declared in His Word the Bible. The fact that God tells us in Genesis that He created all in six days and then rested on the seventh day making it holy and santifying that day for His people the Jews to observe as a way to honor and glorify God, then it is obvious God created the heavens and the earth in six days. Creation is supernatural and so time is not an issue. Those who contradict God’s Word regarding Creation and the global flood prove they don’t believe what God has declared to us in the Holy Scriptures. If they deny the truth in these areas then they will and do deny God’s truth proclaimed in the Bible in other areas.
    16 But shun profane and idle babblings, for they will increase to more ungodliness. 17 And their message will spread like cancer. Hymenaeus and Philetus are of this sort, 18 who have strayed concerning the truth, saying that the resurrection is already past; and they overthrow the faith of some. 19 Nevertheless the solid foundation of God stands, “The Lord knows those who are His” and, “Let everyone who names the name of Christ depart from iniquity. ” 2 Timothy 2:16-19
    Here is God’s analysis of and remedy for those who believe contrary to His Word. Genuine believers will turn away from false teaching and believe and obey His Word which is the Bible. Those who continue in willful unbelief and contradiction of God’s Word give evidence they do not have faith in Jesus Christ as He is revealed in the Bible.
    9 Whoever transgresses and does not abide in the doctrine of Christ does not have God. He who abides in the doctrine of Christ has both the Father and the Son. 2 John 9
    God’s Word the Bible declares Christ to us. Christ validates the Genesis account of Noah and the global flood; His apostles and prophets taught the same. Those who deny the global flood are calling God a liar and are disparaging His Word the Bible which Christ declared to be the truth.
    17 “Sanctify them by Your truth, Your word is truth. John 17:17
    Those who contradict the Bible are arguing with Jesus whom they claim to follow. Whether still under God’s wrath or redeemed and deceived they need to repent and believe Jesus. We who are walking with Jesus must exhort repentance and faith. Those who continue in sin and unbelief we must not fellowship with them.
    14 And if anyone does not obey our word in this epistle, note that person and do not keep company with him, that he may be ashamed. 15 Yet do not count him as an enemy, but admonish him as a brother. 2 Thessaloians 3:14-15
    This should give clarity to the matter, brothers and sisters, stand fast for the truth, exhort the erring brother to repent and believe; preach the truth to the lost. This is for those who are under God’s just wrath who have commented on this post, Jesus Christ commands you to repent and believe the gospel because He loves you and is not willing that any should perish but that all should repent and be saved.

    Liked by 2 people

  10. Peter says:

    Why would God make the world and universe look old? Is God trying to trick us and make it hard for intelligent people to come to faith? If God is truth and does not lie, doesn’t this seem a strange approach?

    If it is because of creation and the ordered universe we can have science, why would God then place all these tricks into the historical record. In essence God has created a world in which science is unable to work properly if that is the case.

    Have trees been created with misleading tree rings? There are some trees of allegedly great age.

    Did the dinosaurs make it onto the ark, or were they excluded and died in the flood? If the dinosaurs were excluded (perhaps they were too big to fit) then Genesis 7:3 seems misleading.

    How did the salt water and fresh water fish both survive in the same mixed water?

    I struggle to see how every animal, insect and bird could possibly have gotten onto the ark. the sheer number of different types makes this a logistically awesome challenge.

    Like

    • Eliza says:

      Trick us? Why would you say that. Creation reveals him to us. It isn’t intelligence that keeps you from faith it’s your willful rebellion against Him that leads you to turn from God and His revelation in the Scriptures. You have much larger problems than the questions you asked if you reject what God says in His Word the Bible.

      Liked by 3 people

      • Peter says:

        I am sorry you have responded in this way.

        Dr John Lennox, in his book ‘The Seven Days that Divide the World: The Beginning According to Science and Genesis’ mentions that Galileo was persecuted by the Church for saying that the world was round and revolved around the Sun. At that time people were convinced this is what the Bible taught. But they had misunderstood the Bible.

        Science and religion should not be enemies. Sometimes science shows that what was thought to be a literal statement in the Bible was in retrospect a figure of speech, a word picture.

        When Jesus says to cut off parts of your body that cause sin, should he be taken literally. Tradition tells us that St Jerome did just that. He later realised the error of his ways and understood it was never intended to be taken literally. It was hyperbole used by Jesus to emphasize that sin is serious and not to be treated lightly.

        Like

      • Eliza, I’m sorry – there’s a weird glitch on some of the comments. The people who are speaking the worst nonsense I’m not seeing a reply to link, so I’m unable to respond to some comments.

        Like

    • Eliza says:

      Peter, you need to carefully consider the conditions on the earth when the great deeps were broken up and water was falling from the sky upon the entire earth for forty days and nights. Remember the flooding a short time ago in Colorado, now magnify that by exponential power. Then keep in mind the density of fresh water and the density of salt water. True there would be mixing and dilution, but not throughout the depths of the ocean, and the inland fresh water would remain fresh. Think about it, use your reasoning powers.
      Keep in mind that in the fossil record there are numerous giant animals (when compared with their relatives today). If animals of a smaller stature were put aboard the ark, and they were, there would be room. Have you calculated the volume of the ark? A cubit is approximately 1.5 feet, the volume of the ark would have been approximately 1,518,750 cubic feet. It was divided into three levels, each level would be 33,750 square feet, times three that would be 101,250 square feet for living and storage. Think about the living space required for eight adults, not much. All the rest would be for the animals and food storage. A lot of animals could be fit in the average 2000 sq foot home. Think about horses, they are somewhat large, think about the size of trailers that are used to haul them. Are you getting the picture now. Not all species within a family would have been on the ark, only what was necessary to preserve the species.

      Like

  11. ltg4dailywalk says:

    For consideration…

    “But whoever would be great among you must be your servant and whoever would be first among you must be slave of all. For even the Son of Man came not to be served but to serve, and to give His life as a ransom for many.” –Mark 10:43b-45

    As I read the narrative in the tenth chapter of Mark, preceding the verses above, I am reminded that faith in Christ does not extinguish human nature.

    The pride of James and John led them to request a preferential place above the other disciples following Jesus Christ. Were they wrong to ask? James died as a martyr as a consequence of his faith in Christ. John was referred to as “the disciple Jesus loved” and went on to write one of the four Gospels, Revelation and three letters canonized in the Scriptures.

    Is this faithful pedigree of the two brothers worth something more than what other followers of Christ may record in life as faith-driven achievements? Shouldn’t James and John get more credit–something more than the other disciples? And, isn’t the same true now? How can a new convert–a fresh off-the-boat sinner–be considered in the same discussion as a person following Christ for 50 years, tithing, and never missing church on Sunday?

    The response of Jesus is clear. And, the example of Jesus is that of a servant, a slave (bondservant), to God.

    The writer of Hebrews notes the humility of Jesus in His example and life on earth:

    “But we see Him who for a little while was made lower than the angels, namely Jesus, crowned with glory and honor because of the suffering of death, so that by the grace of God He might taste death for everyone.”

    What caused James and John, two of the earliest disciples of Jesus to consider themselves better than others?

    Pride.

    Pride is at the heart of much of the divisiveness in Christianity. Pride, breeding arrogance, leads to being judgmental. Judging others as lesser in their faith or out-of-touch with a specific interpretation of the Scriptures has helped to promote thousands of denominations, all claiming to follow Christ as risen Savior, the Son of God. The unity of being in Christ is challenged by apparent well-meaning followers of Jesus.

    For people outside the faith, the divisions are confusing. “So, if they follow the same Jesus, how can so many disagree?”

    One of my dear friends from early in my walk of faith reminded me of one of the primary causes of what can create this type of divisive pride in followers of Christ: “We do not worship the Bible…we worship God.”

    I have shared this perspective in discussions with other followers of Christ when their contextual interpretations of Scriptures create divisions within the unity of following Christ. And they disagree: “I worship God and God’s word is clear.” Many hold allegiances to specific doctrines. Many hold fast to strict, literal interpretation of the Scriptures. Many hold fast to even specific translations of the Bible, one telling me that utilizing a translation other than the original King James version is heretical.

    And, that is the challenge. God’s word and will are not always clear. The early church struggled with interpretation of Scriptures, tradition and the consequential pride-in-position–the belief that what they believed was superior to what others believed, even going so far to judge those in disagreement as lost.

    We have examples (even in the original King James Version) of the challenge of interpreting God’s word and will. Peter refers in his writings to the challenge of reading and understanding Paul. Paul challenges Peter and the Jerusalem based leadership of the early church over differences in perspectives of circumcision, food and their continued adherence to Jewish traditions and laws as applicable to Gentile converts.

    In Chapter 15 of Acts, the story of Paul and Barnabas disagreeing and separating over their perceived value of John Mark was a matter of perception–causing a parting of the ways between two of the early missionaries to the Gentiles.

    Despite these differences, they continued to faithfully agree on their faith, trust, love and hope in Christ. John Mark, derided at the time by Paul, was noted by Paul as a great help in later years. And, this same John Mark wrote the Gospel of Mark, despite Paul’s earlier misgivings.

    So, what is to learn from the examples?

    Worship God- When the focus is on the grace of God though Jesus Christ contextual arguments diminish (but regretfully are not fully extinguished.) Unity in Christ is much more apparent when the full, true focus is on Christ. Again, I am reminded of the Person I follow, not placing the rules, traditions and human interpretations of Scriptures above and ahead of Jesus Christ.

    Be Mindful of Human Pride-Taking words written in the Scriptures out-of-context and using them to further a specific belief or system of beliefs is a function of human pride and nature. Pride, as reflected in the example of James and John, can be divisive and harmful to unity in following Jesus Christ.

    “Judge not”-I am reminded constantly, in my own walk in Christ and contact with other followers of Christ, human judgment will always bring into play human nature and the prejudices, biases and pride we all carry inside of our hearts. Our human judgment will never be perfect, but guaranteed to be perfectly broken.

    Judging others–specifically judging other followers of Christ as less or unworthy–is clearly not following the example offered by Jesus Christ. Worshiping the Bible instead of and/or ahead of Christ is missing the simple words of Christ given throughout His ministry:

    “Follow Me.”

    Like

    • Eliza says:

      I have read all of your comments. I edited the last one, because you included this long passage with it and there wasn’t the necessity to be redundant. I want to answer all of your comments with this reply.

      First, I was on vacation and did not bring my laptop, on purpose, although I did use my IPhone to reply to some comments. For the most part, I do not cut and paste Scripture in any of my writings, there are occasions when I will rarely use that technique with the KJV, but those are always comments on other blogs. I know where the Scripture verses are in the Bible because I have read it through over ten times, have read the New Testament through many more times, and I listen to it on CD when driving to and from work. I am very familiar with God’s Word and He has blessed me with understanding His Word, as He does with all of His children, I am not an exception. Sadly, many who claim to follow Christ know little of His Word and so are easily deceived by those who are false. Much of what I write is to warn others about the deception that is craftily laid for them by the devil so they are used of the devil for his purposes and lose their rewards, if they are believers. I don’t want to see any deceived and led away from the truth that is in Christ Jesus my Lord and Savior.

      Following Christ means following His truth because many false teachers have come into the visible church to lead astray those who are gullible and easily deceived. We must know His truth, this is protection for us and out brothers and sisters in Christ, and brings Jesus Christ glory. Here are just a few Scriptures that speak about truth in the Bible.

      27 And he said, “Blessed be the Lord God of my master Abraham, who has not forsaken His mercy and His truth toward my master. As for me, being on the way, the Lord led me to the house of my master’s brethren.” Genesis 24:27

      10 “I am not worthy of the least of all the mercies and of all the truth which You have shown Your servant; for I crossed over this Jordan with my staff, and now I have become two companies.” Genesis 32:10

      17 “Sanctify them by Your truth, Your word is truth.” John 17:17

      37 Pilate therefore said to Him, “Are You a king then?” Jesus answered, “You say rightly that I am a king. For this cause I was born, and for this cause I have come into the world, that I should bear witness to the truth. Everyone who is of the truth hears My voice.” John 18:37

      3 We give thanks to the God and Father of our Lord Jesus Christ, praying always for you, 4 since we heard of your faith in Christ Jesus and of your love for all the saints; 5 because of the hope which is laid up for you in heaven, of which you heard before in the word of the truth of the gospel, 6 which has come to you, as it has also in all the world, and is bringing forth fruit, as it is also among you since the day you heard and knew the grace of God in truth; Colossians 1:3-6

      18 Little children, it is the last hour; and as you have heard that the Antichrist is coming, even now many antichrists have come, by which we know that it is the last hour. 19 They went out from us, but they were not of us; for if they had been of us, they would have continued with us; but they went out that they might be made manifest, that none of them were of us. 20 But you have an anointing from the Holy One, and you know all things. 21 I have not written to you because you do not know the truth, but because you know it, and that no lie is of the truth. 1 John 2:18-21

      27 But the anointing which you have received from Him abides in you, and you do not need that anyone teach you; but as the same anointing teaches you concerning all things, and is true, and is not a lie, and just as it has taught you, you will abide in Him. 1 John 2:27

      16 “And I will pray the Father, and He will give you another Helper, that He may abide with you forever–17 the Spirit of truth, whom the world cannot receive, because it neither sees Him nor knows Him; but you know Him, for He dwells with you and will be in you. 18 I will not leave you orphans; I will come to you. John 14:16-18

      23 Jesus answered and said to him, “If anyone loves Me, he will keep My word; and My Father will love him, and We will come to him and make Our home with him. 24 He who does not love Me does not keep My words; and the word which you hear is not Mine but the Father’s who sent Me. 25 These things I have spoken to you while being present with you. 26 But the Helper, the Holy Spirit, whom the Father will send in My name, He will teach you all things, and bring to your remembrance all things that I said to you.” John 14:23-26

      26 “But when the Helper comes, whom I shall send to you from the Father, the Spirit of truth who proceeds from the Father, He will testify of Me.” John 15:26

      13 “However, when He, the Spirit of truth, has come, He will guide you into all truth; for He will not speak on His own authority, but whatever He hears He will speak; and He will tell you of things to come. 14 He will glorify Me, for He will take of what is Mine and declare it to you. 15 All things that the Father has are Mine. Therefore I said that He will take of Mine and declare it to you.” John 16:13-15

      31 Then Jesus said to those Jews who believed in Him, “If you abide in My word, You are My disciples indeed. 32 And you shall know the truth and the truth shall set you free.” John 8:31-21

      42 Jesus said to them, “If God were your Father, you would love Me, for I proceeded forth and came from God; nor have I come of Myself, but He sent Me. 43 Why do you not understand My speech? Because you are not able to listen to My word. 44 You are of your father the devil, and the desires of your father you want to do. He was a murderer from the beginning, and does not stand in the truth, because there is no truth in him. When he speaks a lie, he speaks from his own resources, for he is a liar and the father of it. 45 But because I tell the truth, you do not believe Me. 46 Which of you convicts Me of sin? And if I tell the truth, why do you not believe Me? 47 He who is of God hears God’s words; therefore you do not hear, because you are not of God.” John 8:42-47

      Truth is God’s domain and Christ came to witness to the truth. We who are of God listen to His truth and believe what He says. Those who are not of the truth do not listen to Him, but are deceived by the devil. Indeed, they cannot listen to the truth and believe because they do not have the Spirit of Truth in them teaching them and guiding them into all truth. There is no lie in the truth, and we who belong to God through faith in Jesus Christ have the anointing of the Holy Spirit so we know the truth, and know that no lie is of the truth. We adhere to and cling to the truth, just as we are taught by our Savior, Whom we follow. We concur with Christ, because He has taught us by His Holy Spirit, that God’s Word is the truth and we are set apart from the world by believing in and obeying God’s Word the Bible and being led by the Holy Spirit. The gift of the Holy Spirit who indwells us because we belong to Christ always brings us back to the Word of God for faith and practice. We turn away from the liars and deceivers of this fallen world controlled by the devil and resort to the Holy Scriptures that are given to us for our encouragement and edification through the work of the Spirit in the direction of His prophets and apostles in writing the exact Word of God.

      The ones who are highly esteemed in the eyes of men follow doctrines, or teachings, that are contrary to the Scriptures. Jesus, my Lord and Savior, has blessed me so that I can know the truth because I have His Holy Spirit living within Me. You contradict what He has said by saying that we cannot know the truth and that many “Christians” disagree about these things but agree to follow Christ. Which Christ are they following? Are they following the christ of Augustine and the Catholic church that portray Him as weak and unable to save to the uttermost all those who come to Him by faith alone? Are they following the “gospel” that our works somehow save us so we must be baptized or do works in order to be saved? Are they following the teachings and sayings of men that oppose the pure Word of the Lord which alone has the power to transform sinners to saints as they believe what God has said and receive His Son as their Lord and Savior? Which is better, to form a false alliance with those who promote the blasphemy and cacophony of the lying dissidents who reject the sure word of prophecy and replace it with their mere opinions and ideas, or to follow Jesus Christ and those who followed Him, His apostles and prophets through the ages and believe what He teaches us from His Word? Just keep this in mind, in the time on Noah, only eight people were saved from destruction. If you read Genesis carefully you will see that the people of that time “called upon the name of the Lord”. However, only eight people were saved from the global destruction of the flood. Religion doesn’t save us, only faith in Christ as He is revealed to us in His Word the Bible saves us.

      Here are a couple of Scriptures that I want to close my reply to you with.

      23 But avoid foolish and ignorant disputes, knowing that they generate strife. 24 And a servant of the Lord must not quarrel but be gentle to all, able to teach, patient, 25 in humility correcting those who are in opposition, if God perhaps will grant them repentance, so that they may know the truth, 26 and that they may come to their senses and escape the snare of the devil, having been taken captive by him to do his will. 2 Timothy 2:23-26

      16 For we did not follow cunningly devised fables when we made know to you the power and coming of our Lord Jesus Christ, but were eyewitnesses of His majesty. 17 For He received from God the Father honor and glory when such a voice came to Him from the Excellent Glory: “This is My beloved Son, in whom I am well pleased.” 18 And we heard this voice which came from heaven when we were with Him on the holy mountain. 19 And so we have the prophetic word confirmed, which you do well to heed as a light that shines in a dark place, until the day dawns and the morning star rises in your hearts; 20 knowing this first, that no prophecy of Scripture is of any private interpretation, 21 for prophecy never came by the will of man, but holy men of God spoke as they were moved by the Holy Spirit. 1 But there were false prophets among the people, even as there will be false teachers among you, who will secretly bring in destructive heresies, even denying the Lord who bought them, and bring on themselves swift destruction. 2 And many will follow their destructive ways, because of whom the way of truth will be blasphemed. By covetousness they will exploit you with deceptive words; for a long time their judgment has not been idle, and their destruction does not slumber. 2 Peter 1:16-2:3

      Like

    • archaeopteryx1 says:

      What caused James and John, two of the earliest disciples of Jesus to consider themselves better than others?
      Pride.

      That was actually was one of my first thoughts when phillipdean felt it was necessary to inform us of his 174 IQ.

      Like

      • Eliza says:

        Intellectual pride is unbecoming in anyone. However, sometimes it appears necessary to say something to the naysayers who allude to the intelligence of those who hold to faith in Christ and believe what God has said in His Word the Bible. So from your perspective if you believe in Christ and His Word your intellectual prowess is suspect, but if you mention that you do have some intellectual capacity then you are prideful. And so it is always with the foolish, they rave and rave and there is not peace.

        Like

        • archaeopteryx1 says:

          Interesting viewpoint. I too have a very high I.Q., yet see no need to bring it into a discussion of anything other than I.Q.

          Like

  12. gracealone1 says:

    Peter, you don’t even have your “facts” right. Excuse Augustine all you want, he was still a heretic and still revered by the catholics of all generations. To attribute the conversion of Martin Luther to the writings of Augustine is an insult to the Holy Spirit (something that all false prophets are very adept at doing) Who is solely responsible for bringing Luther to Christ, along with the ensuing reformation. Now we see that you have resorted to a modern-day heretic, one John Piper. Mr. “Christian Hedonism” himself. The champion of “Federal Vision” and the man who spawned it, Doug Wilson (a heretic in his own right). A teacher of witchcraft when he tells people that they can and should hear the audible voice of God.

    Funny how it’s always those of us who believe in the inerrant, literal, Word of God that have “misunderstood” how things really are (in the eyes of so knowledgeable and wise as yourself) and yet you cannot see the plain truth right in front of your eyes BECAUSE IT HAS NOT BEEN GIVEN to you to understand the Bible. My words and those from Eliza have made your heart dull, your eyes blind and your ears deaf, just as it is intended. Why? Because we dare to take God AT HIS WORD and you do not. Today is a good day to repent.

    Will you continue to serve the idols of Augustine, Piper, et al, or the Lord Christ?
    CHOOSE.

    Liked by 2 people

    • Peter says:

      I am sorry you think this way. Jesus said a house divided against itself cannot stand.

      I suppose you also call Dr Martyn Lloyd-Jones a heretic? He is considered by many the greatest expository preacher of the 20th century. He was no friend of the Catholic Church calling religion the greatest enemy of Christianity. But he did not tar Augustine with the same brush, rather he considered Augustine one of the mightiest intellects in the history of Christianity.

      When you find yourself labelling as heretics people recognised by Christians over the ages as heroes of the faith surely it should be a warning. I suggest you take a step back and question whether or not you might be mistaken in these judgments. Even the Vandals respected Augustine, they had besieged Hippo as he lay on his death bed. When they destroyed the city they ensured that his library was untouched such was the respect that this man was held even among the barbarian hordes.

      Jesus prayed on the night of his betrayal that those who followed him might be one as a witness to the world. What message do you think criticising great people in Christian history in this manner sends to the world?

      Like

      • gracealone1 says:

        Pete, it seems you can’t read writing even when it’s ‘writ’. You have zero understanding of Scripture and the Lord Who is the Author of it and the main subject of it all. People have blindly followed heretics from day one and you are no different. So worship your idols of Augustine and Piper, et al, obviously you did what I asked you to do, that is to CHOOSE between your idols and Christ, but you have chosen poorly and stand by the deaf and dumb and DEAD idols of the past and of today. None of them will save you from the wrath to come. Hope is not dead-yet-for you, Pete, repent and believe on the Lord Jesus Christ.

        Darrel

        Like

      • Peter says:

        Darrel, I really don’t want this to degenerate into a slanging match.

        I don’t blindly follow Augustine or Piper. But I do respect their opinions. I don’t agree with all that they say. But I consider with respect what they say. Warren Wiersbe when asked who was his favourite Puritan said that he was the disciple of no man, that it was dangerous to blindly follow the teaching of one person, no-one in Christian history has understood all the truth.

        Perhaps you, I and Wiersbe might agree on this. You misunderstand me if you have formed the view that I idolise Augustine. I respect Augustine, I don’t idolise him.

        What I object to is Christians tearing down their own. Attacking Spiritual giants of the past on matters of doctrine. Augustine made mistakes, he was only human, but making mistakes does not make one a heretic.

        Like

      • Eliza says:

        Those people whom you mention are of the world, they are not of Christ. The dissidence comes from the posers who teach contrary to God’s word and create whole movements that are rife with blasphemy and lawlessness.
        Who do you think Jesus was warning His disciples about and condemning in this passage? He was warning about the religious elites who posed as Jews. This is the same thing that has been happening from the beginning, posers who lie and do not know or obey the truth, claim to belong to Christ, and come up with their own doctrines because of their amazing intellect, to deceive if possible even the elect.

        17 “These things I command you, that you love one another. 18 If the world hates you, you know that it hated Me before it hated you. 19 If you were of the world, the world would love its own. Yet because you are not of the world, but I chose you out of the world, therefore the world hates you. 20 Remember that word that I said to you, ‘A servant is not greater than his master.’ If they persecuted Me, they will persecute you. If they kept My word, they will keep yours also. 21 But all these things they will do to you from My names sake, because they do not know Him who sent Me. 22 If I had not come and spoken to them, they would have not sin, but now they have no excuse for their sin. 23 He who hates Me hates My Father also. 24 If I had not done among them the works which no one else did, they would have no sin; but now they have seen and also hated both Me and My Father. 25 But this happened that the word might be fulfilled which is written in their law, ‘They hated Me without a cause.'” John 15:17-25

        Where do we go to hear from and see our Savior? Do we go to the musings of man or do we go to the Scriptures preserved for His children for their edification and encouragement. You can have all those authors you esteem, I will stick with Christ and what He has revealed to me in His Holy Word the Bible.

        Sinners are all saved the same way, by the work of the Holy Spirit in their lives as He leads them to see their desperate need of Jesus Christ to save them from God’s just wrath in Hell , redeem them from their sins and give them eternal life. The state of religion cannot deter the work of God in the heart of the sinner through the power of the gospel of salvation. God bless us.

        Like

  13. ltg4dailywalk says:

    Eliza, I posted a comment several hours ago to further some thought on your perspective and many of those shared in the thread of responses. I notice a number of comments were approved, after submission of mine, while my comment remains in moderation. This comment too will drop into your “Approve” option, but hopefully attract your attention. I was just wondering why you have chosen not to approve my comment? Thank you, luke

    Like

  14. Funny how everyone keeps saying the Bible is full of contradictions – but then they never cite any.
    As to the constant repeated slanders of “stupidity” and “closed minds”, my IQ is 174… and I believe the Bible literally. I take the first chapters of Genesis as literally as I take John 14:6. If Calvin and Augustine cautioned against literally believing the Bible, then Christians should run… RUN… from such false teachers. John Piper may have a more “charitable” viewpoint, but hey… he cites the works of an unsaved man – C. S. Lewis -as his greatest inspiration. Myself, my greatest inspiration is the Holy word of God in its translation in English, the King James Bible.
    I say again, just as I said above… one of those things that make a pastor get VERY concerned about a Christian is the statement they do not take the Bible literally. That worries me greatly, and is cause for me to begin to question that Christian about their testimony, and their doctrinal positions. As I said earlier above – if you’re off on the doctrine of the word of God, then you’re likely very off on every other major doctrine of Christianity.
    Where you have a weak stand on the Bible, you tend towards universalism and denial of the Deity of Jesus Christ.
    For everyone who claims to take a allegorical understanding of Genesis on their comments, here’s my question, and please answer – do you believe Jesus Christ is one third of the Trinity, God in human flesh and the only way to salvation?
    If you cannot answer that with a simple YES, then I say to you… look to your salvation. I’m telling you plainly, you are not saved.
    As I VERY PLAINLY stated, old earth creation beliefs is a symptom of other problems. And I pointed out how truly amazing it is to me that every Christian who bears fruit tells the same story – after they were saved, they no longer believed in Evilution. And that includes me.

    Liked by 1 person

    • Peter says:

      In Matthew 27:5, Judas threw down the pieces of silver in the temple, he departed and he went and hanged himself.

      But in the Acts of the Apostles 1:18, Judas kept the silver and purchased a field with it; he went into it and falling headlong, he burst open and all his bowels gushed out.

      Liked by 1 person

      • Acts 1:8 Now this man purchased a field with the reward of iniquity; and falling headlong, he burst asunder in the midst, and all his bowels gushed out.
        19 And it was known unto all the dwellers at Jerusalem; insomuch as that field is called in their proper tongue, Aceldama, that is to say, The field of blood.
        He didn’t keep the money… one explained that he tried to return the money but the priests wouldn’t keep it, and using the money, purchased a field with it. the account is consistent. it is not a contradiction.
        Matthew recounts how Judas died… Acts recounts what happened to his body after he died.
        No contradiction This one has been dealt with on countless web sites..

        Liked by 1 person

      • Peter says:

        TWO AND TWENTY years old was Ahaziah when he began to reign; and he reigned one year in Jerusalem. And his mother’s name was Athaliah, the daughter of Omri king of Israel. 2 kings 8:26 (KJV)

        FORTY AND TWO years old was Ahaziah when he began to reign, and he reigned one year in Jerusalem. His mother’s name also was Athaliah the daughter of Omri. 2 Chronicles 22:2 (KJV)

        Liked by 1 person

    • Arkenaten says:

      One thing that stands out is how bone-head thick people such as you, Philip, truly are regarding the texts.
      Having an enormous High Queue doesn’t mean much at all in this context as you suffer from indoctrination. And didn’t you know that size never really impress the girls unless you know how to use it – something you clearly are not schooled in.

      Do you get a warm tingle in your High Queue when you write Evilution, by the way?

      You can’t just take the Bible and say ”This is it, boys and girls.” Especially if you are:
      a) completely ignorant of its history, and
      b) completely ignorant of the etymology, the exegeses, and the hermeneutics. And
      c) completely ignorant of the archaeology.
      d) completely ignorant of the fact you have been severely indoctrinated.

      Like

  15. ltg4dailywalk says:

    “Eliza”, You wrote on a response in this thread, March 31, 2015 at 4:24 am:

    “Those who contradict God’s Word regarding Creation and the global flood prove they don’t believe what God has declared to us in the Holy Scriptures. If they deny the truth in these areas then they will and do deny God’s truth proclaimed in the Bible in other areas.”

    That is a very strong statement. At a minimum, it is very judgmental. At the extreme…well, it is extreme. Because you are so confident and knowledgeable in your beliefs and empowerment to condemn so many, here are some questions I am sure you would not be afraid of answering:

    What are you hoping to accomplish?

    Is this for your own pride in the exclusiveness of your beliefs relative to the many “heretics” you condemn? Those you condemn as heretics and outside of Christ includes, but not limited to: “Protestant denominations”; “Augustine” (according to you a “bold heretic”); John Piper; and the universal Catholic Church?

    Where do you find the authority to judge others so harshly–those of the same faith in following Jesus Christ?

    Disagreement among Christians over the creation narrative is nearly as apparent as disagreements over the interpretation of Revelation. Note what I said, “among Christians.” There are four basic schools of thought on the Genesis narrative utilizing the original language of the text–and all have been debated and discussed without any diminution of the redemptive revelation of God throughout the Scriptures and the grace offered in Jesus Christ, the Son of God. None have been scorned as heretical. Your statement is strong and long on condemnation and attempts to place you as an expert in the interpretation of Scripture. So…

    Are you an expert in translating the original Hebrew-Aramaic and Greek language into English?

    If so, it would help to stand transparently, front and center, for the world to know who the person is witnessing and proclaiming God’s word in such a fashion and condemning manner. An expert should feel confident enough to say “I am….” and stand by their perspective and witness. I am sure you agree that you can’t believe everything you read on the internet, right? So, if you choose to be anonymous, are you not at least taking your work, time and effort about 10 notches down below the viability of Wikipedia?

    I do not see your identity on your blog? Why? A witness should not be ashamed of the Gospel, right?

    Are you ashamed of the Gospel?

    How can you proclaim it, knowing what “witness” means and implies? Witnesses step forward, speak the truth…as a testament to the truth. An anonymous witness has how much credibility?

    If you are not ashamed of witnessing the Gospel, why not say who you are and be as bold with your identity as you are with your theology? I reveal mine, completely and totally. I stand by what I say–whether people agree or disagree with me. I share the Gospel the only way I can–transparently, honestly and openly. Why? I do so because it is right and your situation proves the challenges of anonymous witnessing. Otherwise, you are an anonymous apologetic–no different in many ways than many of the troll-like posing posters attacking others while shrouded in the warm blanket of anonymity.

    How does disagreement over the translation of Scripture “prove” people who disagree with your perspective “don’t believe what God has declared to us in the Holy Scriptures” (as you stated)?

    Again, are you an expert in the original Hebrew text?

    If not, who do you rely for your translation? Have you ever looked any deeper than the text for meaning and interpretation?

    As an example, do you know the alternative meanings to the word “day”–as translated from Hebrew? Or, are you simply relying on the English translation as the only, solely and irreconcilably “right” meaning of “day” as 24 hour period of time?

    Spoiler Alert: I urge you to research this before you answer–the Bible was not written in English. The original Hebrew language is not a copy-and-paste simple, word for word, translation into English. This is not to minimize the meaning reflected in the interpretation, but for God’s glory, to clarify what the Scripture intended to say in its original language and context.

    Are you aware that what you have written, by quoting Scripture and using the text to then claim “truth” and empowerment to call people heretics, is not in line with the perfect example of the Son of God, Jesus Christ, the Truth of the Gospel, God’s grace, love and redemption? You dismiss Augustine, John Piper and Catholics as heretics…lost and outside of God’s grace.

    On what authority have you been give the power to judge? Again, if you remain anonymous, your credibility is already lacking.

    In fact, your anonymous status leads me to wonder if you are simply an angry “poser”, posting what would appear to be a some-what Christian thread of messages, only fronting a real disdain and anger for the grace offered through Jesus Christ? If so, that is an amazing effort to prove what you believe can be easily disproved?

    One more time, what is your purpose? To share the Gospel and witness to the grace of God through Jesus Christ? Or to condemn, based on your own interpretation of Scriptures?

    Whatever your intent, whatever your reason, I doubt you will ever publish this post, as you have ignored the other previous comments. For the record, I have copied it–as I did the other–time stamped and posted this elsewhere in case you choose to go even deeper into the self-absorbed, self-righteousness that you splatter in your postings.

    I challenge you to stand up for your witness–for your faith. Say who you are? Research the questions I pose–answer them. And, post this post, inclusive of the following for consideration.

    If you truly believe in what you say you believe–why be afraid to be identified with your perspectives?

    If you choose to NOT post these comments, answering the questions and step forward to be honest and transparent, I have the freedom and right to exercise a questioning of the purpose and benefit to God’s Kingdom of anonymous, angry posters like you.

    I’ll be watching and I’ll be praying for you. You copy and paste Scripture with a reckless abandon, failing to consider context and the fruit of your posts for our Savior, condemning so many acknowledged followers of Jesus Christ with an aloofness and arrogance that boggles the mind. The witness you give to non-believers is that of unloving, judgmental and angry…calling them “dead sinners.” Remember, Jesus came to call sinners–not the righteous. I believe that you need to think and pray about your condemning comments, basing them on Scriptures you appear to remove from context and utilize to attack instead of share, reconcile and offer hope, encouragement–what Christ tells us to do as witnesses.

    And, if this is just a way to stir up Christians, one against the other, well, that can be easily recognized, too.

    I am praying for you.

    Like

  16. Nan says:

    PhillipDean2013 said: Funny how everyone keeps saying the Bible is full of contradictions – but then they never cite any.

    You haven’t been reading many blogs, have you? There are NUMEROUS bloggers that go into great detail related to the MANY contradictions and inconsistencies in the bible. Suggest you do some blogosphere research before making statements similar to this.

    Like

    • Eliza says:

      There aren’t contradictions and inconsistencies in the Bible. If read with understanding then the clarity of the Scriptures comes blazing forth. Since the Bible is God’s truth, which is His domain, He must teach those who are captives of lies to believe and understand the truth. Until that happens then of course the lost will only see what they want to see and not come to know the truth. Jesus Christ has promised that those who believe in and follow Him will be set free by His truth. Repent of your sin and put your faith in Him. See what a glory it is to know Him and follow Him.

      Like

    • archaeopteryx1 says:

      Oh, but Nan – he has an IQ of 174!

      Like

  17. Eliza says:

    I will be home tomorrow so I will be better able to address all comments. Thank you for your patience. Responding through my IPhone is tedious and cumbersome because of slow and unreliable connectivity. God bless us.

    Like

    • Wally Fry says:

      Well I can understand that Eliza lol. It’s almost impossible in fact. Have a safe trip home.

      Liked by 1 person

    • ltg4dailywalk says:

      Eliza, If you want to share some thoughts and defense on what I offered in the comments you retain in moderation, I offer the option to communicate outside your blog if you remain sensitive to exposing your true identity. The concerns I voiced relates to the rapid-fire condemnation evidenced in many of your posts/comments claiming empowerment through copy-and-pasted Scriptures attaching terms such as “heretical” to many acknowledged followers of Christ, all the while remaining anonymous as a poster. This act of serving as an anonymous judge is truly troublesome given the harsh, condemning conclusions you offer. You can email me at luke@lukelively.com Best regards, luke

      Liked by 1 person

  18. SKL says:

    Good God, these religious people of the same loving God are condemning each other to hell because they believe in a different interpretation of a bible passage, a different story about some biblical events or historical religious individuals and of course the stories in the bible such as the age of the earth.

    It is so refreshing to be an atheist because we do not have such a pile of ancient stories to argue about and we are doomed to hell anyway because we believe in life on this planet today. Why would anyone want to argue about things that are claimed to have happened thousands of years ago and the only record being an ancient book that was written, changed and interpreted by many different individuals whom we know very little about and possibly some never existed.

    The God you talk to is only in your head, yet it rules your life because you are not strong enough to question stupidity and recognise logic. To argue and to become so arrogant that you claim you are the true religion of God and the all the rest are not and are not going to be saved by the Lord and are bound for hell is absolutely ridiculous beyond belief and I would be ashamed if I was a worshiper. This is seen by normal people as a most elitist and patronising attitude supported by nothing but unmitigated rubbish.

    Liked by 1 person

    • Eliza says:

      Religions are disparate and do not teach the same thing. They can’t all be right. Only Jesus Christ claimed to be God, came in the flesh, died upon the cross of our sins, and rose again from the dead. He is the coming judge and His message to all of us until that time is repent and believe the gospel. I met Christ, He saved me, and turned me from sinning atheist to godly saint. The joy, peace, contentment and trust that I have in my Savior is so much better than the wicked destruction I embraced before. Repent of your sin, put your faith in Christ. He will save you and give you a new life. He will teach you the truth and the truth will make you free.

      Like

      • Arkenaten says:

        Only Jesus Christ claimed to be God

        No, he didn’t.

        Like

        • archaeopteryx1 says:

          “Only Jesus Christ claimed to be God”
          No, he didn’t.

          Actually, in her comment to me above, in response to my saying basically the same thing as you did, Eliza produced three quotations of verses in which he did. What she failed to mention, is that these were anonymous authors who CLAIMED that Yeshua said those things – anonymous authors who wrote decades after Yeshua lived (if in fact he ever did), who were never there, and were relying entirely on hearsay or their own imaginations.

          Like

          • Eliza says:

            Oh, of course, the retreat of the liberal atheists when then are confronted with the truth to their little made up story about anonymous writers. Then you try to sound all pious by writing Yeshua while spreading your lies. If you don’t repent and trust Jesus Christ as He is declared to us in His Word the Bible you will spend eternity in hell for your very grievous sins.

            Like

          • archaeopteryx1 says:

            Oh, no!

            Liked by 1 person

          • Eliza says:

            You won’t be saying that when you are suffering in hell. How sad that you are unwilling to repent and trust Jesus Christ.

            Like

        • Eliza says:

          Yes He did Ark and as always you are sadly mistaken and sorely misled.

          Like

          • Arkenaten says:

            No, he didn’t, Eliza, and you are sadly mistaken and indoctrinated.
            There is not a single passage anywhere that has the biblical character, Jesus announce ” I am God.”

            Like

          • Eliza says:

            Well yes He did and you can sling that saying of indoctrination around all you want but I didn’t sit under the tutelage of liberal professors for years to come up with my false take on the truth like you liberal trolls have. Nor did I resort to someone else’s vain ideas spread like manure upon the internet. I am taught by God Himself through His Word the Bible. So in essence you are arguing with Jesus Christ and His glorious Word and you are already a loser.

            Like

  19. Eliza says:

    Peter the editors of the NAS changed the wording in 2 Chronicles 2:22, it is forty and two in the original language. The KJV merely represents what was recorded.

    Like

  20. Peter says:

    Eliza

    I am sorry that this blog post of yours has ended up becoming a bit of a war zone. Currently we are not seeing matters the same way. I am interested to explore with others issues in regard to faith that I find challenging and are seeking to work through in my life.

    I realise I got carried away and posted too many times on your blog, I apologise for that.

    I think it would be for the best if I desist from further posts on your blog and seek to discuss elsewhere the issues that are swirling around in my mind and heart.

    I wish you all the best and don’t bear you any ill will.

    Liked by 2 people

  21. gracealone1 says:

    Eliza,
    Don’t you find it interesting how all those who wish to question (disparage) the Word of God all use the same techniques? Of the several commenters here we find their cute little “psych 101” ploys dusted off for use one more time. Specifically: guilt transference. When their wickedness is exposed (unbelief, the Bible is not really the Word of God, it doesn’t mean what it plainly says, etc.) they search high and low to find fault with the one who stands firm in the faith (a faith that they know nothing about). They become experts in all matters relating to Jesus, the Bible, the centuries of man’s religion that poses itself as “Christian” and those who seek to contend earnestly for the faith once for all delivered to the saints instantly become the ignorant buffoons, uneducated, unable to know anything of substance that pertains to the (false) god that they are currently hawking. Next, we are treated to the ego-fest. “I’m smarter than you, more educated, able to understand because I use my brain, etc. The ignorance of those that claim an elevated IQ is all that is needed to decipher the Scripture has been around forever and is evident by what is churned out of the seminaries of our day. Intellectual prowess will never gain a person entrance into the Kingdom of Heaven. It is the gift of repentance and the gift of faith in the Lord Jesus Christ that will bring eternal life, but those of the high IQ crowd are blinded to this and will remain so unless and until the Holy Spirit works in their heart. If these intellectuals had real faith, they would through aside their brain power as useless and recognize the only source of truth is the Bible with the Holy Spirit being their teacher, but this is impossible to do in their current state of denial and unbelief.

    Then there are those that ‘cherry-pick’ the Scriptures. One comment above disputes the Biblical mandate that the creation was done in six literal days, using some spurious and obscure definition of “day” to make his conclusion. He conveniently forgets the last statement of the verses that describe the creation that was done in that one day: “And the evening and morning were the first (and second, third, etc.) day” It really gets pesky and inconvenient to have to quote the entire verse and stay in context, doesn’t it?

    Changing the subject and calling into question those that would expose their nonsense is always a favorite tactic of the false prophets, just as Luke has tried to do. At the same time they skirt any pointed questions directed to them, for to answer honestly would further expose the fact that they are charlatans and frauds.

    And then there is the ploy to get us to agree that all who claim to be “Christian” are really just that, but the sad fact is that most who make the claim are not as evidenced by the fruit they bear (and yes, we are not only allowed to judge others in this respect, we are COMMANDED to do so). Augustine and Piper come to mind, but the list is endless, but the false prophets on this thread would have us take their word as “gospel” when all their life is a lie. There is much more, but enough for now.

    Darrel

    Liked by 1 person

    • ltg4dailywalk says:

      “Darrel” You are an anonymous poster. Why?

      Are you ashamed to stand up and stand out, to be identified as a witness of the Gospel?

      Your profile…no identity. “Darrel” if that is your real name- until you prove you are something more than “anonymous” your opinion carries no credibility. None.

      And, by the way…your judgmental attitude is not “commanded” but simply a product of your own anonymity–brave to accuse in the shadows…but identify yourself, who you are…truthfully, and we can discuss things.

      Be honest and transparent and unashamed of your beliefs and faith…or be “known” that your opinion has no more value than your witness…your anonymous.

      Like

      • Eliza says:

        Luke trying to be gentle and kind with one who is so misinformed is very difficult. Your arrogance against the truth of the Scriptures is leading you in a way that is not good. You should take some time to read the Bible, preferably the KJV or the NKJV, and just ask the Holy Spirit to guide you into His truth. He will if you humbly ask Him.

        The truth is there have always been false teachers, remember the Scripture that I left you with in my reply. That is the point of what God’s Word warns us against. How do we know they are false teachers? Because what they say and teach does not agree with the Scriptures.

        I find it so interesting and somewhat chilling that certainty about the truth is being used as a weapon against those who love Lord Jesus Christ and want to please Him. Let me give you an example of proving that false teaches opposes Jesus Christ and what He has done for us.

        If Jesus Christ’s death is sufficient to pay for all of my sin and His blood cleanses me from all unrighteousness, then why would I have to suffer in purgatory for some amount of time to be cleansed from my sin? Can you not see that the truth of the Scripture is diametrically opposed to the false doctrine of purgatory? Augustine taught and believed in purgatory. He is the father of the Catholic church which teaches and promotes the false doctrine of purgatory. He influenced the Reformers, as attested to by them. John Piper gives credit to C. S. Lewis for bringing him into the light. C. S. Lewis believed in and taught purgatory along with other false doctrine. These false teachers are dangerous and are leading many astray as evidenced by what you have said. Here are links where I expose Augustine, C. S. Lewis and John Piper.

        https://holdingforthhisword.wordpress.com/2014/02/19/the-grid-3/

        https://holdingforthhisword.wordpress.com/2013/11/11/loyal-leadership/

        https://holdingforthhisword.wordpress.com/2013/08/12/walking-in-the-light/

        Like

        • ltg4dailywalk says:

          So, now…who are you? Is this “Darrel” or “Eliza”? How would I know? Do you have a name a real name? Why are you afraid of disclosing your real name? Are you ashamed to post your real name to identify you with your postings? How can you be a witness for Christ hiding in the shadows, afraid to associate your identity with your faith??? What copy and paste verses, taken out of context, give you the power to judge anonymously? Speak up. Say who you are…scientist…theologian…it will add to your credibility if you simply offer your identity. Otherwise, you are just an anonymous person posting defaming, judgmental posts with no credibility…other than you are on record and you keep digging your hole(s) deeper and deeper with every comment. And, btw, you’re IP Address says a lot. Should I say more?

          Like

          • Eliza says:

            I am a mom, a grandmother, and a teacher. I have a masters in Chemistry. You threatening tactics will not be tolerated on this blog any further and if you want any of your former comments to stand then stay away from that tactic. What are you going to send the thought police to come and arrest me? You are a foolish and vile man trying to masquerade as a follower of Christ, but with little success.

            Like

    • ltg4dailywalk says:

      “Darrel” … “gracealone1” Good News…You are not “alone” in your anonymous judgmental posting any longer.

      Nor are you anonymous anymore.

      Since you understand definitions so well, here are two for consideration:

      “Defamation”

      Heard of that? Checkout what you said to me and the numerous defaming names you called Piper… I hope you understand, we are real people.

      Oh, and the second word:

      “IP Address”

      You aren’t alone or anonymous…anymore…you left a great “impression” Those little details people leave on posts…and IP Address says a lot, but I am sure you know that, yet you defamed and posted comments that are now on record…as you are.

      You can hide…but you can’t run–talk to YOU soon my friend about what “defamation” means.

      Like

      • Eliza says:

        Are you threatening Darrel because he exposed false teachers and false teaching? There is plenty of ammunition given to us by the false teachers with which to charge them. I sent the links exposing those false teachers.

        So, you are just one of those ugly deceived internet trolls trying to chill the furtherance of the truth. You are in serious trouble with God and you will have to answer to Him for your wickedness. Why you are just like the Pharisees and the Sadducees who rejected Christ Jesus and had Him crucified. You are a traitor to the truth. How do you like that?

        Like

    • Eliza says:

      Great job Darrel. Again, I am astonished how saying I am a scientist and believe the biblical account of creation and the global flood has brought these commentators out of the woodwork. This is more traffic then I have ever experienced. I guess that was one of those hot button topics.
      My goal isn’t to create controversy but it is to share the truth of God’s Word so that sinners may repent of their sin and put their faith in Jesus Christ. I share God’s Word for the edification of my brothers and sisters in the faith. That is it.
      The visible church is so corrupt that any rebuke against its vile twisting of the Scripture is viewed as a personal attack by those who champion the christianity that is outside of the kingdom of God. God bless us.

      Like

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